Big Bob Bigboote wrote:BHeneghan wrote:We can talk about centerline, Rangers, violations and killing bike races all day but it doesn't change anything. Be part of the solution rather than pointing fingers and making assumptions.

Great!

What solution are you advocating?

Hmm, it's been over a week, and Mr Heneghan hasn't deemed to honor us with the secret of his "solution".

I guess he only has time to harass a hardworking race organizer, not to make racing safer. OK, at least I now understand where he's coming from.

In other news, I've learned that although both the injured women promptly provided accounts of the accident to the NCNCA leadership, only one of them was given the simple courtesy of a response.

Watz up with that? - seems like rather shabby treatment if NCNCA received the report (both were sent to the same email address) and didn't even take the time to acknowledge it.

Somewhat disillusioned, I'm done beating this dead horse.

Time to start training for next season.

BHeneghan wrote:We can talk about centerline, Rangers, violations and killing bike races all day but it doesn't change anything. Be part of the solution rather than pointing fingers and making assumptions.

Great!

What solution are you advocating?

Mr. Tad Borek, please actually read my response before you throw out your opinion. I, in no way, advocated the violation of the centerline rule. In fact I am constantly annoyed by centerline violators and understand your point. Superweek hits you with a $100 fine for a centerline violation. I think that’s a great idea. Anyway, I have been a part of planning a cycling event and know the frustrations of dealing with law enforcement, city councils and the general public.

My point is that YOU WERE NOT THERE but you are bashing the Pro/1/2 field as if you have first hand knowledge. Somehow you are a mind reader and know people actions, intent and attitude. It seems from the tone of your responses that somehow bike racers have hit a sore spot. Anyway, your reply talks about Rangers, centerline violations and how one violation can cancel the race forever. That's nice but that has little to do with this topic because there was not centerline. In fact, I checked the rule book and it doesn't talk about the centerline rule when there is no centerline. I would assume that we would defer to the Vehicle Code. The vehicle code states the following:

Narrow Roadways
21661. Whenever upon any grade the width of the
roadway is insufficient to permit the passing of vehicles
approaching from opposite directions at the point of meeting,
the driver of the vehicle descending the grade shall yield the
right-of-way to the vehicle ascending the grade and shall, if
necessary, back his vehicle to a place in the highway where it
is possible for the vehicles to pass.

We can talk about centerline, Rangers, violations and killing bike races all day but it doesn't change anything. Be part of the solution rather than pointing fingers and making assumptions.

Thanks for the explanation, and I forget about that second factor sometimes.

WarrenG wrote:I thought there was a rule that you're not allowed to ride on the course if you're not racing at the time.

Were there no other roads around better-suited for a ride than the ones being used for the race?

This race was not being held on a closed course. The course was open to traffic. Traffic includes cyclists. USCF rules have no oversight of the general public.

And, there are very few other road options in this area. I bet the women thought they were safer riding backwards on the course, than venturing out into unknown roads in an extremely sparsely populated area.

Since the race was held on an open course, the racers had an obligation to obey the centerline, or where there was no centerline, to yield appropriately to oncoming traffic.

Big Bob Bigboote wrote:We all accept risk WITHIN the race environment, that's a big reason we sign those waivers each time we enter a race.

However, after reading all the accounts of this accident, I can only come to the conclusion that members of the general public were injured due to a failure to conduct a race in accordance with the permit conditions.

Read that last sentence again and let it sink in.

BBB,
Thank you for getting it, you hit the nail on the head by saying "permit conditions". One of our permits (the one that took a two-hour ranger meeting today to finally get signed off) has staying to the right of the yellow line explicitly mentioned as a condition for the permit, and it was made clear that they'd happily refuse to permit the event in the future if everything isn't followed to a T. Yes one guy can kill it for the 48th+ Tam hill climbs. And this has nothing at all to do with USCF rules, though of course those apply as well, and for the same reasons. It's just that the USCF down-side (a DQ - rarely applied) is a lot less than the ranger-enforced downside (ticket + no more race).

I'm throwing this all out on the Internet so everyone knows exactly what happened if this race gets killed.

From this thread it sounds like there is some education to do on this - letting people know that the roads are open and normal rules of the road apply, plus the reminder of the USCF centerline rules and, if just following the CVC & the race rules isn't enough motivation, that it's important to do so because event permits can be pulled if we don't. This last one is an issue even on a wide open road with no oncoming traffic, and I am here to tell you, one of the rangers we met with today would kill our race in a heartbeat and chuckle while doing it. I'm sure there are others out there who are gatekeepers on other races. Some people hate bike races, unfortunately, and they're perceived as dangerous so it's getting harder to get them done.

That's kind of a lot to hit in the pre-race announcements though and enforcement never seems to work, so the other change needs to be in the attitude about this. I've gotten some private emails from people involved in race organization saying, basically, that this is part of the issue, the entitlement/prima donna factor. Racers forgetting that ultimately, it's just a recreational, fringe sport done on the weekends for fun. So you get a guy thinking, man I'm at threshold hanging on for dear life in the left gutter but I have a right to be here! Maybe it'll take killing the oldest race in the west for it to sink in for the BHeneghans of the world -- two gals being run into a ditch doesn't seem to be enough.

-Tad

CRC

I thought there was a rule that you're not allowed to ride on the course if you're not racing at the time.

Were there no other roads around better-suited for a ride than the ones being used for the race?

Having watched this thread from the sidelines up to now, I am saddened to see the opinions expressed fall into two camps:

Some, who not coincidentally seem to be either officials or have experience at race organization, understand that events like this can have big implications for safety and possible loss of courses, but most others look at the information available and label it an "unavoidable accident" and consider trying to understand why it occurred a worthless exercise in "pointing fingers".

Because my work keeps me under the microscope of safety professionals, I've learned long ago that phrases such as "unavoidable accident" and "things happen without any....apparent cause" are only uttered in groups with dysfunctional safety cultures. What you just read is not a provocative insult, but a fundamental truth known by any organization which takes pride in conducting itself in a safe manner.

We all accept risk WITHIN the race environment, that's a big reason we sign those waivers each time we enter a race.

However, after reading all the accounts of this accident, I can only come to the conclusion that members of the general public were injured due to a failure to conduct a race in accordance with the permit conditions.

Read that last sentence again and let it sink in. Don't believe it? What conclusion do you think the Monterrey County Board of Supervisors would reach if they read this thread?

So what caused this accident?

Here's my assessment based on the firsthand accounts presented to date:

1) The primary cause was the failure of the P/1/2 field to follow race instructions. I was at San Ardo and heard the instructions given my field. It was clear this was an open course and the centerline rule was in effect although some portions of the course did not have a centerline (If the P/1/2 field was given different instructions we have an entirely different, but just as serious, problem). We can argue all day about how you implement the centerline rule on a road with no centerline, but if anyone wishes to argue that a reasonable interpretation should allow riding members of the public into a ditch, feel welcome to do so.

2) A contributing cause was a race organization which performed ineffective oversight of race to assure compliance with the race instructions and permit conditions. I didn't see a moto all day in my race, though I also didn't see any events which would require intervention by the officials (I don't have eyes in the back of my head, though). At the time of the accident, no moto was in a position to assure safety and proper conduct by the P/1/2 field. This, combined with the "traditionally very lenient centerline enforcement", set the P/1/2 field up to cause this accident. We know a moto was following soon behind the P/1/2 field, but we do not know what reasons (if any) caused it to be in a position where it could not be effective.

Based on what I think the "root causes" were, I can put forward several possible corrective actions for consideration:

1) Include a briefing on the San Ardo accident in race instructions in the weeks following. At a minimum this should be done for the P/1/2 field, though it would likely benefit all fields. At a minimum the briefing should be done at courses where a portion of the roads have no centerline, though it would have value at other venues. Was any mention of the San Ardo accident made at University or Challenge? I'd bet not.

2) Increase the number of moto's to implement effective oversight of races. If unable to increase the moto's to the desired levels, eliminate fields as necessary to achieve effective oversight.

Sound harsh? I agree, and would welcome less intrusive solutions. But let me repeat: Members of the general public were injured due to a failure to conduct a race in accordance with the permit conditions AND NOTHING HAS BEEN DONE TO PREVENT THIS FROM RECURRING IN THE FUTURE.

This accident should have been a surprise to no one. Safety issues on roads without centerlines had been noted in the past and the moto shortage was a chronic problem. All that was required was to keep pulling the trigger until we found a cylinder with a bullet in it. Who here is in favor of continuing to pull the trigger?

We are extremely lucky that the two women were not gravely injured and both have a connection to the racing community, otherwise we could have a serious issue on our hands which could jeopardize the San Ardo course, perhaps all racing in Monterrey County. Ms. Conniff and Adams should be thanked for their reports and receive a sincere apology (have they?). That's the easy part - for an apology to be sincere saying "I'm sorry" is only the beginning.

Doing something to prevent a recurrence shows we really mean it - so do we?

This was an accident pure and simple. I agree with Brian in that pointing fingers does not solve anything at all. I too was in the the same Pro 1/2 field at San Ardo and at no time, I repeat at no time was there any malicious intent. Period!!!!! There was an assumption from an earlier statement that what happend was heavely lead to believe that it was malicious. Assuming things without acutal facts is not a smart thing to do.

I aplogize if some folks need closure on this, but we need to put this behind us and move along to more positive discussions that stay on topic.

Tad Borek's reply has got to be one of the most idiotic things I have read in the past year. This includes reading numerous news articles about the current Presidential Administration. Give me a break. I was in the race and witnessed the incident, though I was on the rivet at almost 30 mph and a heart rate of well over 180 bpm. Just to clarify, at not time during the race I crossed the centerline when there was an actual centerline painted on the road. At the time of the incident I couldn't tell you if I was on the right side of the road, middle of the road, to the left of the center of the road, on the moon, etc... because we had Neil Shirley drilling it at the front. I do know that I wasn't close to the ladies who crashed. Was the incident unfortunate? Yes. Should it have happened? No. Was it an accident? Yes. I feel bad for anyone that crashes and would have stopped if there was no one around. I would like to stress that there was no malicious intent in the Pro/1/2 peleton because no one knew they were even coming. This is because we were racing and not enjoying a social weekend ride. So please stop your rider bashing. This incident is the definition of an accident. The way things happen without any planning, apparent cause, or deliberate intent.

If the ladies have been put in financial hardship then let's start a collection. I am willing to put in some money if that is the case. Pointing fingers is not going to solve anything. Let's learn from this instead of pissing people off.

I am sorry that I am not the most politically correct person but this has gone way too overboard.

MuertoSwagger wrote:Hope I can help clear things up.

This WAS the P 1/2 field. This WAS an unfortunate accident.

Jquist after your first obnoxious and inane post - Im surprised you didnt simply apologize and cease from further posts on the subject. Unless of course you had some facts. Speculation with such conviction is at BEST - a waste of time for everyone.

Well that does clear things up -- if this is the general attitude out there all bets are off!

Muerto, I cut JQ some slack for his sarcasm, he was ticked. And just for the sake of argument let's call it an accident -- there was absolutely no way these guys who were about to get flicked could have avoided riding like they were in Scotland, at the left margin of the road. That's about as accidental as Janet Jackson's "wardrobe malfunction" but whatever. The indignity of being flicked at San Ardo may be too much to bear for a mere mortal. (Sorry, I know you don't like sarcasm.)

Don't you think at a minimum these gals should have their bike repairs paid for and get an apology? I mean really, a p12 is supposed to know whether the centerline rule is in effect, keep an eye out for that oncoming semi, & know if they push it & it leads to a bad outcome, they'll pay the price. Kind of like Levi not whining about losing a place when he got the time penalty for that water-bottle tow.

In the bigger picture, this thread is really discouraging. Had a long meeting with one of the local permitting authorities yesterday...let's just say the more there's any possibility of stuff like this happening, the less likely it is we'll keep having all these bike races to go to. They're hanging on by a thread at this point, in a way. If this had happened at Tam I don't think we'd see the 48th running of it. We need 5 permits to run it and believe me, it's not easy.

And I actually stopped myself mid-sentence a couple times because I didn't want to go overboard vouching for how safe and responsible us bike racers are - it's my ass if something happens. So do something or don't be surprised when another local race disappears from the calendar, because it's too expensive to run or the permits are too hard to get.

Sorry if I sound negative, I'm not...I just see it as very simple...someone fudged the rules, in a way we all probably have at some point. But this time someone got hurt, so it needs to be fixed -- enforce the rule or whatever it takes. Maybe that's already being done behind the scenes, it's not like everyone reads these boards. And that's fine, it doesn't need to end in a crucifixion. But I don't like the idea of it being left as "well too bad, it's an accident, that's what we bike racers do..."

-Tad

I apologize for the obnoxious tone of my original post, I was irate at the time because friends were injured, and my sarcasm got out of hand. I think I already apologized for the factual inaccuracies in a follow-up post, but if that wasn’t clear, I do so again. I don’t think the post was inane (pointless), as the point I was making was that centerline violations can be very dangerous, as was quite dramatically illustrated by Tad’s post. Is it really that difficult to avoid crossing the centerline, even when it is “imaginary”? I don’t know, I certainly don’t ride at the level of the pro/1/2s, but my group (35+4/5) managed pretty well, and when someone in my group strayed slightly across the centerline, he was immediately disqualified. Personally, I feel it is a rule that should be aggressively enforced.

D-Dub, you showed a lot of class in being willing to stop and help the women.

I’ll shut up now…

Jonathan

That explains a lot. Things happen.

But where are the rest of the riders from that field?

More importantly the moto-ref?

Will, do you know who was assigned to that field?

Ron,

I noticed this thread early on but couldnt post. I made this account over a year ago and have never posted. Not only did i forget my password, but also the screename I created. I signed up a new account with a different email address just so I could post a recount of what I saw. Whoever is responsible for activating the account - never did. It was frustrating watching the thread grow and fester. I finally noticed there was a "memberlist" and sifted through it looking for my screename- found it- got my password emailed to me (fortunately expediently)- and posted.

-D-Dub

D-Dub certainly gives a different perspective of the incident.

Not taking sides, and I know Sharon, she has been cycling and involved with racing for many years, but if D-Dub's perspective is accurate then it appears as an unfortunate accident.

But it sure would have been nice if this information would have been available a little sooner. Probably not in the best interest to let things like this fester when you have information that would keep people from getting all wound up and talking about DQs.

And where is this illusive moto ref? Couldn't he/she stepped up to the plate and shed some light on the situation?

Is being responsive really that difficult? This would seem to be relatively important.

Don't just do something, stand there and watch silently as people get made out to be undeserving villains.

Ron

More:

As best as I could tell, no one intentionally stuck their arm out like a "stiff arm", which is the picture I feel is being painted. I feel like I saw this quite clearly - although as already mentioned it was at the end of the race and quite hard. If I am wrong, I thoroughly apologize.

My last post was simultaneous with jquist's last post, ironically.

-D-Dub

Hope I can help clear things up.

This WAS the P 1/2 field. This WAS an unfortunate accident.

Jquist after your first obnoxious and inane post - Im surprised you didnt simply apologize and cease from further posts on the subject. Unless of course you had some facts. Speculation with such conviction is at BEST - a waste of time for everyone.

Casey was right on in suggesting this was the result of a "communication breakdown".

The incident occured on the final lap on the narrow section of bumpy road just north of the finish line. There was no centerline. I was at the back of the field and had a clear view of what happened. We were indeed going very fast through there and it was pretty darn hard right then with riders coming off the back. About two thirds of the way back in the field, several riders were slightly echeloned out to the left. Again, it was a very narrow section. It was clear these riders did not see the approaching ladies until it was too late. I could see that the approaching 2 riders moved as far right as they could, while slowing down. Their crash was kind of a low speed tip over/slam ( which most of us have done at one point or another). It looked like it certainly had the potential for them to be quite injured. I think few in the field actually even saw this happen. I slowed up and prepared to stop and make sure they were ok. Fortunately the moto stopped and I could rejoin the race. And MAS fortunately these ladies were ok. Nobody was over there as an opportunity to "move up". It was going too fast for that and everyone was just trying to find shelter from the wind.

Anyway, glad everyone is ok.

Kudos (for lack of a better word) to the people who used some common sense in suggesting what likely happened without seeing it firsthand.

Lets all use our heads and take care of each other.

-D-Dub

From Tracey Adams, the other woman involved in the accident:

I am Tracey Adams, one of the women involved in the incident at San
Ardo Saturday. My girlfriend, Sharon Conniff, and I had been doing
the route in reverse so as to stay away from the racers. We were on
the flat portion of Paris Valley Rd. when the incident occurred. We
had just waved to our friend Daryl Smith in the group ahead of the
group in question. About a minute later we saw a large group coming
toward us at a high rate of speed. The front of the group began
warning the back of the group that we were there on the right. As
soon as we saw the group coming we moved as far over to the right as
we could possibly get, actually in the dirt. We saw riders in the
back begin passing and coming over into our side of the road. We were
unable to move over any further. The passing riders came way over to
the right and one of them put his arm out. We couldn't move over
anymore without going into the thistles. Sharon had nowhere to go and
put on her brakes, I ran directly into the back of her, since there
was nowhere for me to go either. Sharon landed on her face as she
went over her bars, I landed on my side and got some very bloody road-
rash. The passing cyclists nearly ran over my head. Sharon has
abrasions on her nose, chin, forehead and shoulder. The motor with a
race official (striped shirt) was right behind the cyclists and
stopped before I was even able to get up, which was pretty quickly
since I was so mad. He spoke with us briefly and advised us to go to
the the first-aid tent at registration. I'm sure he saw the whole
thing and knows what group it was. I'm afraid we were trying so hard
to avoid being hit that we were unable to get any numbers.

Tracey Adams

JQuist wrote:“Unfortunate Accident”? I think not. In this case, some riders in that group blatantly violated the centerline rule, apparently to improve their position, resulting in the crash and injuries.

Yeah what's the final word on this? We (at CRC) are very concerned about centerline violations as there was a very bad incident at Tam a few years ago that might have been avoided if everyone in the pack was thinking of the yellow as a firm line that you absolutely, positively must not cross.

Needless to say we revisited the issue of course-safety as well as our liability - not just to racers, but to some guy who is just out for a drive. After much discussion, including with an attorney, we are trying to get the word out more and, really, relying on strict enforcement of the centerline rule by race officals. We figure if you're blind to the safety issues, and a med-evac landing on Highway 1 the prior year isn't enough to discourage you, maybe you won't risk a DQ & suspension. See our race web site under the announcements and the linked photo of some other racers in a group that "should have known better." We'll be posting some flyers at registration as well. Please tell your teammates - don't yellow-line at Tam!!

But as I said we're relying on enforcement. If a pair of riders is forced off the road, crashing into the gravel, by definition you have a centerline violation -- I don't care how faded the paint is. And it's every rider's responsibility not to hit an oncoming vehicle or rider. This isn't just a "USCF violation", it's a CVC violation. If these were two local riders just out taking a spin -- let's make them 13 year olds -- and their parents called it in to CHP as a injury-accident hit and run there would be hell to pay. And it would be the end of San Ardo. So I can't understand how this is being considered, as someone posted "an unfortunate accident."

Can someone post an update on this? I have a feeling other promoters may be thinking the same thing so I posted here, but feel free to email me directly: tadborek at pacbell.net.

-Tad

CRC co-director

It was NOT the Pro 1/2 field. I was driving support and would have definitely seen that accident happen or the result thereof for I was at the back of the Pro 1/2's.

“Unfortunate Accident”? I think not. If someone was forced across the road due to members of the group avoiding a hazard such as a pothole or an aggressive dog (which happened in our group), and caused the women to crash, that would be an unfortunate accident. In this case, some riders in that group blatantly violated the centerline rule, apparently to improve their position, resulting in the crash and injuries. It was a dangerous move (obviously), very poor judgment on their part, and it shouldn't be tolerated or excused. These were very experienced racers, they should know better.

I can see how the accident could occur. In our race, a rider was clearly using the no centerline rule to allow him to attack the field from the back and get off the front. As they said, break the rules for a Tshirt?

Maybe the DQ should be the team of the rider(s), that will put on team peer pressure to race within the rules.

In general, I think that everyone should be mindful of their behavior during EVERY race - as we're all visitors to any given area that we happen to be racing in from weekend to weekend. Whether it be urinating in public, swearing at locals when they happen to cross a course at an inopportune moment ("get the f**k out of the road!"), parking where we're not supposed to, or fanning out and hogging the road in a race in an area where there's no painted centerline (and so on) - from the local residents' perspective, we're simply a nuisance.

Those sort of things lose courses. Two Rock is a good example. We also lost a road race course near Davis during my tenure as the USAC Collegiate Cycling regional director due to public urination.

I've seen people simply not thinking with their heads. In the aforementioned collegiate race, the CR DQ'ed a fifteen rider break because many riders fanned out across the road over the centerline - and on a short uphill riser. They couldn't see if a car might have been coming in the opposite direction.

At San Ardo a couple of years ago, I saw a couple of riders decide to take a natural break while on the bike on the flatter section about five miles before the one climb. They decided to do this on the FAR LEFT side of the road (all the way near the shoulder on the opposite side of the road). No centerline, but enough bends in the road to obstruct some view if cars were to come in the opposite direction. I said to my buddy, "hey, watch this". I then proceeded to yell out "CAR UP!" at the urinators (mid-stream). Hillarity ensued - use your imagination.

Please use some common sense, folks. Bike racing is a hard enough sport as it is. We've seen far to many folks get hit and/or killed in the last few years. We don't need to keep adding to that list.

Mind you, I'm not pointing fingers at anyone in the incident in question here. Just making some observations.

Cheers.

Alden Tanaka
Team Velo Europa-Cyfac

So, we've gone from a malicious, intentional (potentially criminal) act to an unfortunate incident (dare I say "accident"?) that may or may not have involved a violation of the centerline rule. I think we can put this thread to bed.

Sad that a Moto Ref was right there and nobody got DQ'd.
Better to DQ the entire field then to lose a course or have a major wreck. Maybe time to get a second number in the middle of the back and have a video camera in the follow car. Every time people start moving over the center of the road, line or none, turn the camera. After the race, go through the video of the bad section and DQ riders that are riding on the left side of the road. If the Moto Ref yells at them and they don't leave the race, recommend a 6 week suspension. Do this a few times and the problem (or problem riders) will go away.

Actually according to the motor official who was there this event happened on a section of road that didn't have a painted line down the center of the road. While technically the centerline rule is still in affect for roads like this traditionally centerline enforcement on roads like this is very lenient. It doesn't look like ( from what I've been able to find out so far) like there is any one individual rider or couple of riders who can be assigned fault for this incident. It appears that the 1/2/Pro field was riding in a way they often do on narrow roads with no painted centerline. It seems there was a breakdown in communication from the front of the group to the back of the group to warn of oncoming, non race traffic, so the back of the pack knew to move to the right.

Again according to the Motor official who was with the group there were other cases in areas where there wasn't a painted centerline where oncoming cars or bicycles moved to the edge of the road and stopped to let the field pass. There were also a couple of cases where the oncoming traffic moved as far to the right as they could safely but kept advancing slowly and the field and the oncoming traffic safely passed each other. At this point I'm not sure what was different in the case talked about in this thread that caused the oncoming cyclists to fall.

Well, I have to apologize for being so reactionary, I made a mistake and I’ll accept appropriate punishment and abuse with quiet dignity. I misinterpreted a critical detail when I listened to the account of what happened. I heard the term “pushed” and took it too literally, picturing someone physically pushing them, when it was actually a number of riders in the rear of the field that crossed the centerline to the opposite shoulder, in effect “pushing” or forcing the two women off the pavement and causing them to crash in order to avoid a certain collision. Still, the blatant centerline violation is totally unacceptable behavior by riders who should know better. Firsthand report follows (posted with Sharon’s permission):

Jonathan

# # #

Casey -

My name is Sharon Conniff and I was the other rider involved in the incident at San Ardo on Saturday. As our husbands were racing, Tracey Adams and I planned on riding a training ride around San Ardo and rode the course in reverse in order to not be in the way of the race.

Our ride was going very well and we were very aware of the racers on the road and the road conditions. We had made a point to ride single file and far to the right to ensure everyone's safety and not to be of a hindrance to the racers. To make it very clear, all of the other categories of racers had been following the guidelines of center line and were racing safely.

We were on Paris Valley Rd. in one of the flat sections that had very good visibility and road surface - it was probably about 2-3 miles north of the finish line. A large group of racers had just gone past us and I believe it was the 45+ as we saw a friend of ours, Darryl Smith of ICCC in the pack.

Approximately 30 seconds behind, another large pack of 40 or more was coming and riding at a very quick pace. By their fitness and speed I assumed it was either the pro,1,2 or the cat 3's. The racers at the front of the pack were aware of us on the road and maintained their position on their side of the road and motioned to the riders behind them that there were oncoming riders (us). Unfortunately the racers at the back of the pack must have felt that this was their opportunity to move up within the pack and were spread across the entire road and made no attempt to move back within the centerline therefore forcing us off the road.

I saw that they were not moving to their side of the road and slowed attempting to evade a collision with them. Unfortunately I had nowhere else to go as I was already off the pavement in the gravel and my friend Tracey was also forced off the road and in to me. We both ended up on the ground. She received bleeding abrasions to both her arm and her shin on her left side and I did a header off my bike ending up in a face plant on the side of the road. I fortunately only received a bump on my forehead, bruised chin, bruised shoulder, abrasions to my nose, shoulder, knee and a jammed finger. My bike also had bent handlebars and shifters.

The moto official that was following the pack stopped to help us and see if we were OK and recommended we stop at the first aid tent. We slowly rode in towards the finish line and found my husband there. We probably should have gone immediately to the first aid and filed a report then but all we really wanted to do was get back to our RV where we had a first aid kit and get cleaned up.

I wish that I could give more concrete information as to the specific riders at fault but unfortunately my face was in the dirt and I did not see their numbers. I am certain that the moto official saw the incident and saw their complete disregard for the stated safety regulations of centerline.

It is appalling to me that certain riders, and again I do not mean all as it was only a few, show such complete disregard for not only their own safety but the safety of others. They were not near the finish as they still had another 18 or so miles on that lap and it was not a closed course. Would they have behaved in the same manner if it had been an oncoming vehicle? Maybe so, and for what - a t-shirt?

Sincerely,
Sharon Conniff

Man, sorry to hear even that some people had the impression this happened (not saying it didn't).

I have to say, I've seen serious and repeated centerline violations at that race in the past. Had to sic a moto official on members of one team that repeatedly advanced over the centerline on the rolling part of the course and then were miffed, to put it mildly, that I told them that was 1) not kosher and b) unsafe.

Then, heading to the finish -- you know the bridge section, which is one narrow lane in each direction with a concrete guard rail on each side? That's where a bunch of people attacked over the double yellow, AS A TRUCK WAS APPROACHING, forcing them, after their illegal gains, to shove back into the pack. Not that there was really room for them then (or ever for blatant and unsafe cheaters). Needless to say, these guys had a distinct advantage heading to the final corner to the finish.

That was worse than the year one of my pedals fell off... at least that was funny.

I was in the 35+ 4/5 a group, we went by them near the end of the rollers before the freeway. They seemed to be ok then.

I was a participant in the cat 3 race at San Ardo and I did not witness an incident of the type you described. I'm not saying it didn't happen, and I wasn't riding at the back of the pack where I could be sure that it didn't happen. The only thing I can add to help identify the general group is that the 3's field did not have any moto or other follow vehicles for the entire race, so if the moto that stopped to help was directly behind the field in question then it was unlikely the 3's field. I'm sorry that this incident happened hope that everyone involved is OK and that some resolution is achieved.
Bill Dunham

Casey is the Man.

Get him some real details so to file a complaint and go from there. I personally would like to hear the details of this one.

Geez, I have a hard time when a rider goes to the tarmac in accident let alone an intentional act.

Unacceptable.

Will

Too many times things are stated on forums without knowing exactly what happened. I would be interested to really know the facts pertaining to this unbelievable-shocking incident. With correct facts, whitness accounts, etc correct opinions cannot be stated. No one likes to hear or read things like this. It is quite unfortunate for all parties involved.

No, I didn’t see the incident. Both women are friends, and I spent time with them after the race, where they described the incident in as much detail that they could. My understanding is that it happened on the rolling section of the course. They weren’t able to identify the group specifically. They both thought it was either the pro/1/2s or the 3s, but the group passed by too fast to get any numbers. There was a moto ref present, who stopped to make sure they weren’t injured. He told them that he would report the incident to Robert L. The ref would know which group it was, and may have seen more of what took place.

Rereading my original post, I realize that, from my description, someone could imagine the women riding along on a flat, straight section of road, and when the group passed them, someone intentionally crossed the road, knocked them over, and rode on. That didn’t happen. Both women described the entire group as passing very close to them, and someone shoved them, hand to body contact, causing both women to crash. I don’t remember whether they said they were on a bend in the road or not. I’ll post more details when I get them, as well as ask them for a first-hand account.

this:

Quote:THE COURSE WAS OPEN AND CENTERLINE WAS IN EFFECT. THE COURSE ENDED AT THE CENTERLINE

is a good point.

Jesster, I agree!

JQuist - Did you whitness this race incident first hand? If so do you know the rider numbers of the group, or groups? You were not specific in your comments as to which race group. Did the individuals who were involved see the rider numbers? This would help in knowing who, meaning which race group may have been involved. Just curious...

This report is so extreme that it hardly seems plausible. If it is accurate, it changes my naive view of the community of our sport and our region.
How could it be possible that riders would intentionally assault two non-racing women in such a manner, or that a group of riders would witness such an assault during a race and not report it?
I can't fathom that such extreme idiocy exists in our sport/region, and choose to believe there is more to the story.

This is going to piss off a lot of people. Please let us have a first-hand account of what happened.

If specific rider(s) can be identified then I can certainly help someone put together a compliant to USAC that could lead to a possible suspension. If a specific rider(s) can't be identified then I'm not sure what could be done re a formal investigation and or sanction.

i certainly hope an investigation is underway regarding this incident.

does anyone have any details regarding action at this time? did anyone submit a complaint to the chief official at the race? did anyone record the numbers of the riders in question so they could be questioned? did anyone take any witness statements?

please don't sit back on the sidelines for this one - we need to self-police our racing for the safety and enjoyment of all. please step up and send in your statements if you witnessed this incident. Objective, fact-only descriptions of what you saw would be very helpful in figuring if there is disciplinary action needed. Casey, could people send you their statements? Or, is there a more appropriate person to send them to?

mhernandez